Germany sees sharp rise in incidents of Islamophobia

And even if they tried they failed since these people weren’t very smart. Like seriously I’ve seen people who live here in Europe for longer than they lived in their country of birth and still can’t string a proper sentence together in the language of the country they live in.

Ah yes only the very intelligent can learn to speak our sophisticated language.

This is such a incredibly stupid and hypocritical accusation, since like you correctly spelled out before they weren't given many opportunities to do so. Since they were poor most had/have difficulties learning a language while also working construction, where most their coworkers aren't german speakers either and housing costs force them to live in areas where they don't have much cause/opportunity to bother with other germans. This is unlike most of the germans living in Turkey who dont bother to learn turkish out of sheer laziness.

I had a friend who came here speaking turkish and arabic and learned farsi, urdu and kurmanci before german because thats the people he had contact with. On the other side I have lived in Turkey as a german and a lot of the other europeans there did not bother to integrate at all, but chose to live in gated, self-segregated communities where they had as little turkish culture as possible.

Here in Denmark the right wing faught hard to make sure no actual integration would happen. Now they point at the badly integrated immigrants and say "look, they're not even interested in being integrated".

We have laws that prevent immigrants from getting jobs, and a language course that isn't mandetory. These laws are in place because of the right wing party "Danish Peoples Party" didn't want immigrants to be able to succeed.

How are people supposed to be integrated when they can't meet the people they need to integrate with?

When we got a shitload of ukrainians, the law preventing them from working was abolished, but only for ukrainian refugee. Guess what? The ukrainians are integrating amasingly. Turns out, if you get to socialise with people, you're more likely to learn how to behave around those people.

Yep, history repeats itself again. Netherlands and Germany imported a ton of laborers from North Africa and Turkey after WW2. But they literally only let the equivalent of redneck hillbillies in, since they were cheaper than educated urbanites. Germany and Netherlands needed cheap labor to rebuild after the war, but they wanted the cheapest of the cheapest. So most of them were illiterate subsistence farmers. And everyone thought that they would go back home after a few years so no efforts were made to integrate these people. And even if they tried they failed since these people weren’t very smart. Like seriously I’ve seen people who live here in Europe for longer than they lived in their country of birth and still can’t string a proper sentence together in the language of the country they live in. Not to mention most are religiously conservative and conservatives are not known to be openminded which makes it hard to integrate them.

Lo and behold two generations later the descendants of these migrants are overrepresented in the jobless, school dropout and crime stats.

Can you explain how what I said is racist? I was talking about cultural practices, societal organisation. The cultural differences I allude to are all rather well-established anthropology. *Left-wing* anthropology on top of that, Emmanuel Todd started that whole thing.

On the flipside, can you explain how "the germanic skull is uniquely shaped in a way that maximizes both ignorance and arrogance." isn't? Can you show me those phrenological characteristics in this example? The man does speak better Low Saxon than me, that's for sure, so obviously he's more German, even more Saxon, than me.

EDIT: As to your edit:

Ridiculing these tirades usually result in a smug dismissal of the conversation while claiming victory or it angers the german causing it to respond with wishes or promises of harm.

If that's not straight-up projection I'd say pot calling the kettle black, don't you think? Not even an tiny bit of smug dismissal in there?

If you actually went through my history you'd have seen that I called what Israel is doing a genocide on every second occasion, and have been saying "The Kahanites will use the opportunity" on like day two after October 7th.

Are you saying that in western liberal democracy a good citizen speaks only English and German?

The "only" is your addition, and your addition alone. At least *try* to argue in good faith, will you. Do you have no other trick but straw-manning.

As to "incoherent walls of text": Go read Emmanuel Todd if you need further elucidation, in particular "The Explanation of Ideology: Family Structure & Social Systems". It's not the most recent, there's been further empirical research after that but the broad strokes still stand and the book is an easy read.

Unlike you, I won’t say that Germans by nature have an urge to commit genocide.

[citation needed]. If anything I would say that humans have, regrettably, that tendency. Humans are rabidly violent creatures.

Also I was always, and only, talking culture, in this thread. Not nature as in genetics or something. Why do you keep making shit up.

make wildly racist claims

accuse others of making arguments in 'bad faith'

the germanic skull is uniquely shaped in a way that maximizes both ignorance and arrogance resulting in often incoherent ramblings with no clear point. Ridiculing these tirades usually result in a smug dismissal of the conversation while claiming victory or it angers the german causing it to respond with wishes or promises of harm.

Sensei, I am a citizen now so I have every right you have. Are you saying that in western liberal democracy a good citizen speaks only English and German? Is French okay as well or is it forbidden? What about Spanish, Turkish, Dutch, Hebrew? Would you say this chart is accurate?


Seriously though are you okay? I’m legit having trouble following your line of argument and your strategy seems to be to completely overwhelm everyone with incoherent walls of text.

Btw I can also go through your comment history, don’t be a racist dick just because you have family in Israel. Maybe tell them to stop being genocidal maniacs and maybe stop being one yourself.

Unlike you, I won’t say that Germans by nature have an urge to commit genocide. I just think some people like you are giant dicks for supporting that and for all the hatemongering.

Maybe you can teach me how to become a proper citizen, someone as decent as you are sensei?

Nah you'll fit right in: Your incapacity to engage with a topic in good faith rivals that of AfD voters.

You do seem to be aware of the crass differences in societal organisation. Maybe, on reflection, you could see that I wasn't actually dissing your clan, I was pointing out that you care about it. Arabs coming here tend to be caught in between their familial obligations and what local society expects of them as individuals, and struggle to regard the people around them as not strangers (because not clan members) but familiar (because you're living in the same region).

Go ahead, make the jump, say "My clan is now <village in Bavaria>". That is *hard*. It's more than just moving to a different place, it's changing very core, and often unconscious, concepts about how identity and the in/outgroup distinction is constructed. Suddenly, you're expected to be familiar with people you don't even know, that you've seen at no wedding, no nothing. Migrating between different region-based societies is kinda akin to marrying into another clan: Sure you'll have to adapt but you already know the basic rules. Switching between the two systems a whole different game altogether.

When I went to an anti-genocide protest I learned that I’m not allowed to speak Arabic

You don't have a right to assembly in the first place, as a foreigner, though it's generally tolerated. If you want to influence German politics, why speak a language that practically noone here understands? Your English seems to be just fine, and from what I recollect police were also fine with English. They need to be able to tell whether you're shouting "Peace be on earth" or "Gas the Jews", simple as that.

Which you'd readily understand if you had a region-based mindset: The necessity to stick with the people around you, instead of the cousin half-way around the earth. What will the cousin think if you're standing in Berlin, not speaking Arabic, bowing to the sensitivities of the local heathens? Heavens! What will other clans think if members of our clan do that kind of thing, our standing will be tarnished! We must uphold our image of virtue or our sons and daughters will never marry into a rich and powerful clan! Why even protest if it's not in Arabic our cousins won't understand and they are the ones who need to see that we're doing the virtuous thing!

Yeah I've seen those pictures you sent, posing in front of a Mercedes, to show how well you're doing abroad: Just like a Sheikh, your family can be proud. Was it at least a rental or did you use a parked one?

Yeah I had a really hard time fitting in. It was pretty difficult not to constantly harass women when I first arrived in Europe. My mom told me to treat women with respect but my Arab nature just makes it impossible.

My plan was to live from social benefits and steal jobs from people like you but I never received any benefits so I just ended up working because apparently no local was able to do that job (wtf are you guys doing?).

I also had a hard time fitting into liberal, democratic society. My natural urge to oppress women and dominate locals was only topped by my inability to accept freedom of speech.

When I went to an anti-genocide protest I learned that I’m not allowed to speak Arabic and that a Palestine flag is a terror symbol, which somehow makes sense again considering that Palestine is also a middle eastern country and it’s in our blood to be terrorists. On the other hand you can basically say that everyone in Gaza should be killed and it should become a parking lot and that seems fine? I’m still trying to figure out how freedom of speech works given that I have never experienced it before.

Maybe you can teach me how to become a proper citizen, someone as decent as you are sensei?

Jesus, if british comedy didn't exist, people would think English is just for joyless, shitty, jerks

So make us drink water, say what you wanna say

Not what I said, bye.

I mean you said it yourself, answer is obvious. Peace!

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

Yeah that’s trivial to mention. I still care about why they shared the anecdote and you can repeat the obvious as much as you want but it won’t answer my question.

Neither, they're giving an anecdotal example of the effects of what I previously noted.

I think everyone saw issues will happen 10 years ago, when Germany took excessive amount of refugees. Though on the one hand, way before the migration crisis, Europe had been criticised for not taking in both migrants and refugees, many of whom died being denied entry. You can never please both sides when it comes to migration.

Thanks, this doesn’t explain why OP is sharing that anecdote and I still don’t know what they’re trying to say with it.

Are they saying Germans hate Muslims? Are they saying hating Muslims is justified?

Germany took in a ton of refugees (migrants is the wrong word), some percentage of which have has extreme trouble moving into a very different culture, it was a huge culture shock for everyone and it had led to problems inside the country that are fueling this hatred.

Not fucking rocket science.

As in, Muslim men behaving badly towards them?

What are you trying to say here?

You're conflating Israel with Jews.

Nah just the crowd that doesn't read the news from the "lamestream media" and prefer getting the news from >30 second shock clips with zero context.

>Nobody in the woke left is thinking that “the Jews are doing a genocide against Muslims”.

Three comments above yours:

>which means it’s implicitly endorsing Israel’s genocide of Muslims.

I think that proves my point about people not reading anything and just reacting to things without considering context at all.

I don't know what "the tiktok crowd" is, but I suspect you're talking about the woke left somehow. So let me respond to what I think you're saying, and if I'm misunderstanding, just correct me. Nobody in the woke left is thinking that "the Jews are doing a genocide against Muslims". The accusation is that Israel is committing a genocide against the Palestinians. Israel and Jewish people: not the same thing. Muslims and Palestinians: not the same thing.

And both groups suffer. Too bad one is prosecuted more than the other; that imbalance worsens the problem.

We can do a venn diagram of people that think Jews are committing genocide and against which group. White supremacists believe Jews are doing a genocide against white people, The tiktok crowd thinks Jews are doing a genocide against muslims.

Both of these groups hate one another despite the fact they're saying basically the same things. Hopefully it stays that way, some really bad things happen when the Nationalists and Socialists realize they have common ground in their hatred of Jews.

A large part of islamophobes are also antisemitic.

The reason Islamophobia is rising in Germany is that Germany aggressively censors anything critical of Israel because it incorrectly conflates it with antisemitism, which means it's implicitly endorsing Israel's genocide of Muslims. *Of course* Islamophobia is going to increase when it's effectively supported by the state!

Yes or maybe the reason is the far right rising like everywhere else in the west. Not everything related to Germany has to do with the holocaust.

I've met German (and French) women in Australia who've openly said they've got a Muslim men problem. e: I was somewhat shocked to hear it as an Aussie. We were all at a party round a fire and they all started comparing stories of hassles they got back home.

They're so paranoid about any hint of repeating what they did to the Jews that they're gonna accidentally do it to Muslims this time instead.

just like in every other european country, there were almost no steps towards integration. this is what you get.

This is what happens when you make your Staatsräson "never again to those people in particular" as opposed to "never again to anyone ever", then spend two years pretending that anti-Semitism is an imported problem, and end up saying that an illegal war by a genocidal apartheid state is your own dirty business.

Merz keeps telling lies it is imported. Not true.

https://jewishcurrents.org/bad-memory-2

“How could a society turn so fanatical?” a group member named Nazmiye later recalled thinking. “We began to ask ourselves if they could do such a thing to us as well . . . whether we would find ourselves in the same position as the Jews.” But when they expressed this fear on a church visit organized by the program, their German hosts became apoplectic. “They told us to go back to our countries if this is how we think,” Nazmiye said. The session was abruptly ended and the women were asked to leave.

I feel like this might be happening in every country that accepts/got a lot of foreigners. It doesn't matter what your religion or skin color is. Japanese people constantly complain about westerners as an example.

If you left your own country, there is a high chance you left it because you, unlike others, failed to be succesful, which statistically already puts you in the risk category.

Where I'm from, we're mostly complaining about too many Russians in the country

For Germany, yeah, that's people from different continent with a strong, vastly different religion

Is there an actual article about this or only a summary? Like what's considered a verbal attack? A breakdown between physical attacks seems like important information. Did they only start gathering this information in 2023 or is there more historical data to compare it to for context?