u/LadyAutumn

A negotiated trade agreement with them would be huge going further into this trade war. It would make a massive difference for Canadians. Probably greatly help us over the recession. But, I definitely have questions about what it would look like.

That all being said, it's probably bad optics for Carney right now. It's probably in his interest to delay this until after the election.

How can my car data, which in all connected vehicles from anywhere is already available and being sold online to whoever wants it, prove a security risk to Canada? How can they car censor me? And why would they want to? We all buy their shit constantly. You're living in a house that is, in all likelihood, half Chinese produced products. They want to sell their cars to us because they can undercut all the regional competition and make massive profits in our market.

China already provides at least half of the products we use in day to day life. If they wanted to strong arm us into joining their country, or whatever you mean by sovereignty, they could do so tomorrow by cutting us off. Significant sectors of our economy would collapse. I don't see why this would benefit them though. They don't have to turn themselves into an international pariah to get all our resources. We trade them willingly.

A far greater threat to our sovereignty is the neo nazi militarized dictatorship state to our south. We are going to have to do business with China. We are in a significantly worse position without them, and the lives of our citizens are drastically affected in that scenario. I don't at all buy that China is attempting to inject itself in Canadian society to censor talk about Tiananmen square or the ethnic cleansing of the Uyghurs. Whether we talk about those things or not changes nothing. Canada isn't prepping to invade China over human rights grievances or something.

In any case, EU and other East Asian markets do not have the EVs we are looking for. China is the world's leader in EV markets. Nearly every top EV company globally is Chinese. EU is buying Chinese EVs. Pretty much everywhere else is also buying them. Because the alternatives are invest in massive public transportation infrastructure (all for this) or develop a decades' worth of technology that China has and everyone else doesn't. The answer in that situation is pretty easy for most governments to make.

Canada is nowhere close to viable nationwide public transportation. If we started today, we could have it in maybe a decade. It's not happening at all right now. I happen to live in an area with none whatsoever. Local busses are twice a day kind of deal. If you have a job you need a car or to live within walking distance of your work. So I'm going to need a car for the foreseeable future. The car I can afford is a used gas engine car. Barring Chinese EV introduction to Canadian markets, I will be driving a gasoline car for at least another decade or 2. I can't afford to save up the kind of money needed to afford a new EV at the costs regional dealers are charging for them. It just won't happen. I also can't loan or lease because I'm not an idiot. So I'm stuck with gas until Chinese EVs are brought in or until another international manufacturer becomes competitive with them, which due to the technology divide, could be quite a while.

For all those reasons and more, yes I'd be absolutely delighted to hear that Chinese EVs were coming to Canada.

Can we actually get the 10 thousand dollar EVs please

They can spy on me all they want i have no fucking clue what i do that could possibly be beneficial to Chinese intelligence that they can't already readily find on the internet. We post everything. All the major American and Canadian corporations are already stealing and selling our data en mass. Their cars do too actually. Japanese cars as well. Any device with any connection to the internet does. Unless you're buying something explicitly opposed to that. And even then they still do half the time.

I'd like a cheap car that is efficient, long lasting, and well made please. Can we not also have a trade war with China. Let's not do that. It's not going to end well for America. I'd love to stop driving a gas car. I will almost certainly never be able to do so with American made vehicles. I'd love it if China flooded our auto market with EVs. Can we get a petition going lmao

Oh cute, it's like a little throwback to the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact.

Capitalism artificially creates scarcity (or the illusion of scarcity) to generate capital.

This article is pro-imperialist fascist propaganda.

Closer to a third voted for him.

We live in an era of mass communication, unlike what was feasible during any other point in history. More now than ever the working class is the working class wherever they are. The working class of the United States have much more in common with us than they do the ruling class.

We should absolutely be promoting an understanding of their struggle. Nationalism is an illness, even if it's nationalism to a non-fascist state.

This exactly, yes.

You called it a flawed democracy. I said that it's not flawed it is broken. It's not democratic. The people do not get what they want.

The democratic party "leaves room" for leftists like Bernie Sanders and AOC, in that they can hang around and talk sometimes. Only as long as they have no actual power and can't affect change in any way.

I wasn't aware we were arguing. You didn't respond to 95% of what I said. And that's fine, but you can just say that you can't or don't want to consider anything I've said. You don't have to say that I'm "making a lot of false equivalences"? I'm not really sure what you're referring to by that.

If you had read the rest of my first line, the American electoral system has always been broken. This isn't a new state of affairs. The working class of America has been in a perpetual state of manipulation into further and further right-wing politics since at least the presidency of Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan.

He won this election with fewer votes than he lost in 2020. Ultimately, the popular vote is largely irrelevant as the number of votes overall is not what determines who won the election. He won in 2016 without the popular vote. Voter manipulation and strategic disenfranchisment won them that election and this one.

Correct, so the American public had a choice between conservatism and fascism. A state of affairs that outraged many people. The democrats and the Republicans share an interest in their corporate benefactors. They will unite to seek better outcomes for the ruling class at the expense of the working class. The democrats will and have consistently refused to adopt popular politics like those of Bernie Sanders and AOC. Those politics are in contrast to the desires of their benefactors.

The working class has been manipulated through a union of the education system and mass media to indoctrinate them into fascism and further anti worker politics. Even in traditionally democratic held states, there is a persistent refusal to educate children on anti-imperialist and anti-capitalist politics. There is a refusal to educate children on the failures of American democracy and an insistence on nationalist indoctrination. In red states, this is even worse. These problems have existed since at least the presidency of Richard Nixon and to differing extents even before then. American fascism is the system. It didn't start yesterday, and has been manipulating the American working class for a very long time.

Even more than that the entirety of the media and education systems unite to indoctrinate the working class into anti working class politics. It indoctrinates the people into believing civil unrest is wrong, that protest and demonstration is wrong, that all political violence is wrong. This is deliberate. It is a deliberate effort to protect the interests of the ruling capitalist class.

Socialism is an alternative to capitalism. You have been indoctrinated by the capitalist ruling class into believing that socialism has never functioned. It has and continues to do so today. Socialism and authoritarianism are not equivalent concepts. The failure of authoritarian socialist states were failures of authoritarianism, not of Socialism. Capitalists have taken advantage of those failures to manipulate billions of people, like yourself, into seeing Socialism as the problem. It isn't. Capitalism is and has been a global failure. A system that serves the self interests of billionaires is a failure. A system where workers do not own the fruits of their own labor is a failure. A system that tolerates landlords and private corporations is a failure.

The US electoral system is broken and has always been broken. Republicans have spent the past 2 decades gerrymandering and introducing as much legislation as possible to manipulate the outcome of elections in as many districts as possible. They've introduced legislation: to prevent people with debt from voting, to prevent people with criminal records from voting, to prevent people who cannot physically make it to polling stations from voting. The Republicans and the ruling class own all the largest media organizations in the United States, and they have weaponized social media and traditional media to indoctrinate and manipulate as many people as possible.

Trump won this election with fewer votes than he lost in 2020. He won mostly because Republicans and Democrats are material allies in neoliberal and imperialist endeavors. Democrats refused to campaign on progressive politics, instead choosing to run on a more conservative campaign than they ever have before.

The working class is not responsible for their own manipulation at the hands of the ruling class. It is not their fault that the system is broken. It is not the fault of American families who literally can not afford to resist, as without the income from their jobs, they will lose their homes and be unable to feed themselves and their children.

Capitalism is the problem. Conservatism, and by extension neoliberalism and fascism, is the problem. Donald Trump is an accelerationist fascist. He will not wait and seeks to plunge the nation headlong into fascism as soon as possible. But do not mistake that as being in opposition to the social and political system of America. Donald Trump is entirely a representative of the failure of American democracy, not a representative of the American people. He manipulated people into voting for him, as evidenced by widespread outrage at his actions even among those who ostensibly voted for him.

To your last part, that would likely end hundreds of millions if not billions of lives. The world population is several times larger than it was during the second world war. A conflict at scale between the United States and China would absolutely be a global conflict.

For no reason other than to illustrate how many lives another world war would take, World War 2 resulted in the loss of life of at least 3% of the world population. That figure in 1946 was somewhere in the range of 70 to 80 million. 3% of the global population today would be 246 million people.

I don't point this out to be snide, just to say that it is absolutely a worst possible case scenario if the United States and China go to war against each other. It would affect the lives of every human being on earth. Those nations do not share land borders. It would mean widespread invasion and destruction of other nations in both hemispheres.

They also have a border with Canada at St Pierre & Miquelon.